Who's Out
07/22/2020 11:44:48 PM
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With some school districts voting to go all virtual to start the year and MSHSAA guidelines saying schools that are all virtual cannot compete, looks like Hazelwoods, McCluers, and Ritenour are all out from the St. Louis area with that rule. With Hazelwood out could also mean no Sioux Passage this year unless someone else puts it on. Would also bump up some schools at the top enrollment of all classes. Looks like most areas will begin in Tier 2, which would mean masks required except during strenuous activity and no fans at events.
With some school districts voting to go all virtual to start the year and MSHSAA guidelines saying schools that are all virtual cannot compete, looks like Hazelwoods, McCluers, and Ritenour are all out from the St. Louis area with that rule. With Hazelwood out could also mean no Sioux Passage this year unless someone else puts it on. Would also bump up some schools at the top enrollment of all classes.

Looks like most areas will begin in Tier 2, which would mean masks required except during strenuous activity and no fans at events.
07/22/2020 11:51:05 PM
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Right now all of St. Louis County is allowed to practice with only 10 or less athletes and no contests. I’m not sure when that will be lifted. I think it is telling that none of the reopening plans even mention extra curricular activities.
Right now all of St. Louis County is allowed to practice with only 10 or less athletes and no contests. I'm not sure when that will be lifted. I think it is telling that none of the reopening plans even mention extra curricular activities.
07/23/2020 12:31:50 AM
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Joined: Oct 2015
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Then you see pictures like the SWMO running camp retweeet by mo milesplit today with no social distance and almost no mask during indoor learning sessions and way more than 10 kids together.
Then you see pictures like the SWMO running camp retweeet by mo milesplit today with no social distance and almost no mask during indoor learning sessions and way more than 10 kids together.
07/23/2020 10:46:17 AM
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Joined: Oct 2019
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The 2020 Paul Enke/Hazelwood Central XC Invitational that was scheduled for Sept. 19, 2020 at Sioux Passage Park has just been canceled. We plan to try again on Sept. 18, 2021. Coach Camarota Hazelwood Central
The 2020 Paul Enke/Hazelwood Central XC Invitational that was scheduled for Sept. 19, 2020 at Sioux Passage Park has just been canceled. We plan to try again on Sept. 18, 2021.

Coach Camarota
Hazelwood Central
07/23/2020 1:16:46 PM
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[quote=therace]Then you see pictures like the SWMO running camp retweeet by mo milesplit today with no social distance and almost no mask during indoor learning sessions and way more than 10 kids together.[/quote] Technically they aren’t in STL County so they aren’t following the 10 athlete rule. But.... It’s very frustrating to be doing everything in your power to try and be safe to try and make a season happen. Then you hop on social media and see this and many other teams across the state taking 0 precautions what so ever. It’s irresponsible, our sport is incredibly easy to make safe and still get high quality training in yet some people just don’t seem to care. Hope MSHSAA doesn’t outright cancel and looks for other ways to make this season happen - whether it’s delayed or whatever. Kids work too hard for the powers that be just go the easy option of just cancelling without exhausting all options.
herace wrote:
Then you see pictures like the SWMO running camp retweeet by mo milesplit today with no social distance and almost no mask during indoor learning sessions and way more than 10 kids together.


Technically they aren't in STL County so they aren't following the 10 athlete rule. But....

It's very frustrating to be doing everything in your power to try and be safe to try and make a season happen. Then you hop on social media and see this and many other teams across the state taking 0 precautions what so ever. It's irresponsible, our sport is incredibly easy to make safe and still get high quality training in yet some people just don't seem to care.

Hope MSHSAA doesn't outright cancel and looks for other ways to make this season happen - whether it's delayed or whatever. Kids work too hard for the powers that be just go the easy option of just cancelling without exhausting all options.
07/23/2020 11:49:03 PM
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Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 90
On Monday I emailed MSHSAA's Board of Directors. Professionally expressed my concerns with the responses (specifically questions 2 and 3) provided in July's Q&A Communication. Mark Linneman took the time to respond and welcomed having a phone conversation. I expressed how the "all sports or no sports" is a lose-lose outcome and guarantees a 0% participation opportunity for all students. Also, that the NFHS with the guidance of Sports Medicine professionals outlined and defined the range of "high risk" and "low risk" sports. So, MSHSAA would not be "picking & choosing" which Fall sports could have a season. The NFHS has provided this guidance just as they have for phasing of re-opening and returning for summer activities. I share this in hope that more coaches share their voice with MSHSAA. Observation: It is interesting that while inequality is a focal point real time decisions continue to be made and rules continue to remain unchanged that may only add to an issue. Come September, there maybe Friday night lights for some high schools that have decided to have the option of in classroom school as opposed to those high school with only virtual classroom.
On Monday I emailed MSHSAA's Board of Directors. Professionally expressed my concerns with the responses (specifically questions 2 and 3) provided in July's Q&A Communication. Mark Linneman took the time to respond and welcomed having a phone conversation.

I expressed how the "all sports or no sports" is a lose-lose outcome and guarantees a 0% participation opportunity for all students. Also, that the NFHS with the guidance of Sports Medicine professionals outlined and defined the range of "high risk" and "low risk" sports. So, MSHSAA would not be "picking & choosing" which Fall sports could have a season. The NFHS has provided this guidance just as they have for phasing of re-opening and returning for summer activities.

I share this in hope that more coaches share their voice with MSHSAA.

Observation: It is interesting that while inequality is a focal point real time decisions continue to be made and rules continue to remain unchanged that may only add to an issue. Come September, there maybe Friday night lights for some high schools that have decided to have the option of in classroom school as opposed to those high school with only virtual classroom.
07/24/2020 10:37:50 PM
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Maplewood-Richmond Heights starting the year online
Maplewood-Richmond Heights starting the year online
07/25/2020 8:56:50 AM
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As a cross country coach, I disagree with all or non idea. I believe..... Softball Girls Golf Cross Country I am sure I am missing other sports that social distancing can be maintained and still have a season. Just my thoughts this morning.
As a cross country coach, I disagree with all or non idea. I believe.....

Softball
Girls Golf
Cross Country
I am sure I am missing other sports that social distancing can be maintained and still have a season.
Just my thoughts this morning.
07/25/2020 11:19:55 AM
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Starting the year online doesn’t necessarily mean they have lost their entire season does it? They just can’t compete until they offer some form of in person, correct?
Starting the year online doesn't necessarily mean they have lost their entire season does it? They just can't compete until they offer some form of in person, correct?
07/25/2020 11:35:04 AM
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@MinnesotaSlim I believe you are correct.
@MinnesotaSlim I believe you are correct.
07/25/2020 1:11:28 PM
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@zoughaibs Tennis is another possibility
@zoughaibs Tennis is another possibility
07/25/2020 3:31:11 PM
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Joined: Oct 2015
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@MinnesotaSlim correct if they go back to some in person format in the district they could compete. However, many are online through mid-October at least, so would be unlikely to do fall sports. IN XC would need to get your practices in then compete in at least 5 meets to be eligible for districts at the end of October. Can also add Afton to the 100% online start.
@MinnesotaSlim correct if they go back to some in person format in the district they could compete. However, many are online through mid-October at least, so would be unlikely to do fall sports. IN XC would need to get your practices in then compete in at least 5 meets to be eligible for districts at the end of October.

Can also add Afton to the 100% online start.
07/25/2020 3:54:55 PM
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@therace You sure about the 5 races rule? I thought it was like 1 or 2?
@therace

You sure about the 5 races rule? I thought it was like 1 or 2?
07/25/2020 4:20:25 PM
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Joined: Oct 2015
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@MinnesotaSlim From the 2020 MSHSAA Cross Country Rules Missouri Points of Special Emphasis [url=https://www.mshsaa.org/resources/Activities/CrossCountry/2020%20Cross%20Country%20Rules%20Review%20Announcements.pdf]https://www.mshsaa.org/resources/Activities/CrossCountry/2020%20Cross%20Country%20Rules%20Review%20Announcements.pdf[/url] (or page 3 of the 2020 Cross Country Manual D.2) 8 b. A school must schedule/participate in at least five regular season meets to be eligible to participate in the district meet. Individually an athlete has to participate in one regular season meet, but as a team have to have five.
@MinnesotaSlim
From the 2020 MSHSAA Cross Country Rules Missouri Points of Special Emphasis
https://www.mshsaa.org/resources/Activities/CrossCountry/2020%20Cross%20Country%20Rules%20Review%20Announcements.pdf
(or page 3 of the 2020 Cross Country Manual D.2)

8 b. A school must schedule/participate in at least five regular season meets to be eligible to participate in the district meet.

Individually an athlete has to participate in one regular season meet, but as a team have to have five.
07/25/2020 4:44:09 PM
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@therace Thanks for the info, never knew the 5 team races rule but I doubt it really had a major impact until this year.
@therace

Thanks for the info, never knew the 5 team races rule but I doubt it really had a major impact until this year.
07/29/2020 10:16:01 AM
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Joined: Apr 2020
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Looks like Dominos are falling and more and more STL area schools starting online for multiple weeks. Up to MSHSAA now to see what they do. Do they continue to say if you don’t have in person you can’t compete, do they move the season, or just move forward without a big portion of the State.
Looks like Dominos are falling and more and more STL area schools starting online for multiple weeks. Up to MSHSAA now to see what they do. Do they continue to say if you don't have in person you can't compete, do they move the season, or just move forward without a big portion of the State.
07/29/2020 3:19:47 PM
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Kirkwood, Webster Groves, and Parkway virtual. Parkway will be virtual till Oct 23.
Kirkwood, Webster Groves, and Parkway virtual. Parkway will be virtual till Oct 23.
07/29/2020 4:50:40 PM
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Joined: Oct 2015
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Illinois is running 4 shortened seasons. Keeping cross country in the fall (August 10-Oct 24th), sports such as football, boys soccer, and girls volleyball moving to spring(Feb 15-May 1st), and adding a summer season(May 3-June 26) for some spring sports. Pattonville has also jumped on the virtual train in the STL area. Incarnate virtual until at least Sept 4th. Heard the North Kansas City Superintendent said something about larger classes such as 5 and 6 in football having start date for sports pushed back at their board meeting the other night. NKC pushed their start school date back to Sept 8th. He's president of the board of directors for MSHSAA so might be something there.
Illinois is running 4 shortened seasons. Keeping cross country in the fall (August 10-Oct 24th), sports such as football, boys soccer, and girls volleyball moving to spring(Feb 15-May 1st), and adding a summer season(May 3-June 26) for some spring sports.

Pattonville has also jumped on the virtual train in the STL area. Incarnate virtual until at least Sept 4th.
Heard the North Kansas City Superintendent said something about larger classes such as 5 and 6 in football having start date for sports pushed back at their board meeting the other night. NKC pushed their start school date back to Sept 8th. He's president of the board of directors for MSHSAA so might be something there.
07/29/2020 6:07:55 PM
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Where does it specifically state in the MSHSAA Handbook By-Laws that a school district MUST be in a traditional school setting (kids in the classroom)in order to practice sport and participate in competition? Page 45 Q4: How should our high school determine our "normal school day"? A4: Your normal school day is based on the maximum number of credit-bearing classes that a student can take during a semester during your publicized school day. ---The response does not define in part or in whole that a "normal school day" is a student physically sitting in a classroom, but rather class credits.--- Page 47 2.3.4 Grades 9-12 Enrollment Options for Academic Eligibility: The following options are available to students in order to meet the requirements of By-Law 2.3.2 a and b above (page 42...grade requirements for participation during and prior semester) b. Non-Traditional Option 1 1. The student is an enrolled student of the high school but ALL OR SOME OF THE COURSES/CREDITS ARE NOT TAKEN AT THE LOCAL HIGH SCHOOL (virtual, post-secondary, work study, etc). ---The way the I am interrupting this by-Law is a student remains eligible to participate in sport or activities though he/she is not physically in the classroom but enrolled and taking online courses through the high school.--- This means MSHSAA does recognize virtual learning (online classes) as part of of what meets the Academic Eligibility requirement.
Where does it specifically state in the MSHSAA Handbook By-Laws that a school district MUST be in a traditional school setting (kids in the classroom)in order to practice sport and participate in competition?

Page 45
Q4: How should our high school determine our "normal school day"?
A4: Your normal school day is based on the maximum number of credit-bearing classes that a student can take during a semester during your publicized school day.
---The response does not define in part or in whole that a "normal school day" is a student physically sitting in a classroom, but rather class credits.---

Page 47
2.3.4 Grades 9-12 Enrollment Options for Academic Eligibility: The following options are available to students in order to meet the requirements of By-Law 2.3.2 a and b above (page 42...grade requirements for participation during and prior semester)
b. Non-Traditional Option 1
1. The student is an enrolled student of the high school but ALL OR SOME
OF THE COURSES/CREDITS ARE NOT TAKEN AT THE LOCAL HIGH SCHOOL (virtual,
post-secondary, work study, etc).

---The way the I am interrupting this by-Law is a student remains eligible to participate in sport or activities though he/she is not physically in the classroom but enrolled and taking online courses through the high school.---

This means MSHSAA does recognize virtual learning (online classes) as part of of what meets the Academic Eligibility requirement.
07/31/2020 10:12:58 AM
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Joined: Apr 2020
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Is there anything stopping a timing company from hosting a “Running Club” series of XC races slated for October into November on different courses where racing would be allowed? Athletes would compete for their club and not their school in order to get something out of this season, and also a time out of this season for purposes of college recruiting. Maybe a timing company could try and think about the kids and finding a solution that works more than MSHSAA?
Is there anything stopping a timing company from hosting a "Running Club" series of XC races slated for October into November on different courses where racing would be allowed? Athletes would compete for their club and not their school in order to get something out of this season, and also a time out of this season for purposes of college recruiting.

Maybe a timing company could try and think about the kids and finding a solution that works more than MSHSAA?

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